Jump to content


Photo

My Introduction


  • Please log in to reply
40 replies to this topic

#21 FloridaMedic

FloridaMedic

    Advanced Member

  • Banned
  • PipPipPip
  • 790 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 04:50 PM

Wow, and I thought nursing was notorious for eating their young! Way to attack a new and VERY enthusiastic RT. Since I have taken the time to get to know him better, I can say that he is very excited about his career, often exhibited by his curiosity and investigation of evidenced-based practice. As previously stated by Gila, Tom is working on his baccalaureate in RT. He may be seeking thoughs experienced with content external to academia. It may only be my opinion, but your tone does come across as fairly aggressive, adversarial, and often condescending. You seem to be a valuable, experienced and enthusiastic RT, but unfortunately not approachable.

Now looking at the original post, this corpsman intends to also obtain licensure as an RN as well as RT. I'm sure John could quickly calculate the statistics faster than I could, but there are tremendously more HEMS RN jobs than RT. Depending on where in the country Matt wants to live, there are virtually no prehospital HEMS RT jobs, only interfacility. So, at least relative to HEMS, Tom's statement is fairly accurate.

What might be productive, would be a discussion and direction regarding RT opportunities beyond HEMS. Matt is pondering making a significant academic commitment to obtain dual licensure.


Showing him there is much more to RT is not attacking him. Telling him as a new RT not to sell the profession short until he gets experience is not attacking. But then, I am saying RT can have opportunites also, not just nursing. Sorry if that offends you as a nurse.

To be clear, I am not attacking him and I have told him this in PMs and I will announce it to the world on the AARC forums in a blog about this topic. But, I do believe he should get some experience as an RT before selling the profession short. I have invited him to the AARC forum where many of us are very approachable. There are many excellent RRTs out there who are more than willing to give him credible advice and resources. If he is already accepting that nursing is better and that there are no opportunities for RTs or that there is no way in hell he could work HEMS, then he is already giving up as an RT despite his degree. Examples of HEMS teams have been given even if there are very few. We also don't know what the future will bring to RTs. If the new kids coming out of school with BS degrees have already signed off on RT having no opportunities nor none can be made, then the future truly sucks for RT.

There are only 100,000 RTs in this country. There are nearly 4 million RNs. There are many flight teams and only half are really worth applying for and some are just looking for warm bodies. So yeah you can be a flight nurse fairly easily especially if you are willing to settle for less.

Opportunity is one thing but what do you really want to do? RT has a very specific focus and if that is your passion that is what you should do and try to get on with a specialty team or one of the few HEMS.


The OP also deserves to hear that RT is a great profession and not just nursing is the greatest.

If you read the OP's question carefully he also expressed interest in NICU. The Neonatal component is a different ballgame. If you just want to do HEMS as emergency response, being a Paramedic would be the way to go in many more places. Not RT and not RN.

Also, please do not make IFT especially for the Specialty teams sound like they are of no value. Transporting a 23 weeker with a congenital heart defect can be just as intense as most of the patients transport on an average day by HEMS.
  • 0

#22 TexRNmedic

TexRNmedic

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 257 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 05:00 PM

To be clear, I am not attacking him and I have told him this in PMs and I will announce it to the world on the AARC forums in a blog about this topic if necessary. But, I do believe he should get some experience as an RT before selling the profession short. I have invited him to the AARC forum where many of us are very approachable. There are many excellent RRTs out there who are more than willing to give him credible advice and resources. If he is already accepting that nursing is better and that there are no opportunities for RTs or that there is no way in hell he could work HEMS, then he is already giving up as an RT despite his degree. Examples of HEMS teams have been given even if there are very few. We also don't know what the future will bring to RTs. If the new kids coming out of school with BS degrees have already signed off on RT having no opportunities nor none can be made, then the future truly sucks for RT.

There are only 100,000 RTs in this country. There are nearly 4 million RNs. There are many flight teams and only half are really worth applying for and some are just looking for warm bodies. So yeah you can be a flight nurse fairly easily especially if you are willing to settle for less.

Opportunity is one thing but what do you really want to do? RT has a very specific focus and if that is your passion that is what you should do and try to get on with a specialty team or one of the few HEMS.


The OP also deserves to hear that RT is a great profession and not just nursing is the greatest.

If you read the OP's question carefully he also expressed interest in NICU. The Neonatal component is a different ballgame. If you just want to do HEMS as emergency response, being a Paramedic would be the way to go in many more places. Not RT and not RN.

Also, please do not make IFT especially for the Specialty teams sound like they are just bullshit. Transporting a 23 weeker with a congenital heart defect can be just as intense as most of the patients transport on an average day by HEMS.


Now that is a post that I can appreciate and almost agree entirely with. I don't want to go off into the PM vs RN vs RT for scene work. I also can agree that in my limited experience, some of the most challenging patient's have been found in the ICU and NICU. I truly do value the expertise of the neo and pedi team members. Cheers.
  • 0
Wes Seale
Houston , TX

#23 FloridaMedic

FloridaMedic

    Advanced Member

  • Banned
  • PipPipPip
  • 790 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 05:07 PM

What might be productive, would be a discussion and direction regarding RT opportunities beyond HEMS. Matt is pondering making a significant academic commitment to obtain dual licensure.


Agreed.



You should see by now that would be a mistake on this forum. This is primarily a HEMS forum. There are also very, very few RTs here for some very good reasons.

The only advice given out here to an RT will be to get a nursing degree just as you did.

If he really wanted to do HEMS as an RRT, a list of a few teams have been given. Those involved with the teams are on the Transport Section of the AARC forum.

It will all depend on if he gets excited by the world of Respiratory Therapy or wants to join Nursing. Both have very different focus points and very different management styles. For the first 5 years he will have to work in a hospital setting as either an RRT or RN before he gets to the point where he can apply for a team of any type.
  • 0

#24 flightrrt

flightrrt

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 79 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 08:29 PM

For Tom, he still has not acquired enough experience as an RT to offer any positive comment.


Dear FloridaMedic:

Can you please define what "enough experience" is in order to "offer a[] positive comment"? My understanding is that the flightweb is a collective community of health care professionals, from all walks and experiences, to share information. Should we request that people who do fit into your "experience" threshold be banned from posting onto the forums? Moreover, should we make you the gatekeeper to determine who passes this threshold? In my opinion, you would delete every user that does not comport to your viewpoints.

Another observation... I have always wondered on why somebody who bashes the paramedic profession, while trying to gain support of the RT profession, would utilize a screen name of "FloridaMedic".
  • 0
Aaron J. Lund, JD, LL.M., CHC, CHPC, CHRC, RRT-NPS
Healthcare Corporate Compliance Officer
Former, Flight Respiratory Therapist

#25 Gila

Gila

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 588 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 08:54 PM

This forum is indeed a collective community of many various providers. Also, IMHO, there exists a strong RT presence here. I welcome the OP to this site and will be curious to see what they do with their career. I believe that a non-homogenous mix of providers and individuals with varied educational backgrounds from business to biochemistry only provides us with additional diversity. It is my belief that diversity and many viewpoints allows me to appreciate a discussion from another viewpoint. Even if I disagree, the diversity keeps me looking outside of the box so to speak.
  • 0
Christopher Bare
"Non fui, fui, non sum, non curo "

#26 FloridaMedic

FloridaMedic

    Advanced Member

  • Banned
  • PipPipPip
  • 790 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 08:59 PM

Dear FloridaMedic:

Can you please define what "enough experience" is in order to "offer a[] positive comment"? My understanding is that the flightweb is a collective community of health care professionals from all walks and experiences to share information. Should we request that people who do fit into your "experience" threshold be banned from posting onto the forums? Moreover, should we make you the gatekeeper to determine who passes this threshold? In my opinion, you would delete every user that does not comport to your viewpoints.


Tom is newly credentialed. That is easy enough to confirm and he himself has posted this information along with others who have stated he is finishing his RT degree.
A newcomer to the profession should not be so down on it until has had an opportunity to experience it.

Another observation... I have always wondered on why somebody who bashes the paramedic profession while trying to gain support of the RT profession would utilize a screen name of "FloridaMedic".


I have been a member of this forum for 6 years and took me over 2 years to admit I had an RRT credential. At the time RTs were bashed unmercifully on this website as were nurses. There were many statements that neither RNs or RRTs has any place outside of the hospital including on specialty teams since apparently just by title made it impossible for us to find out way around an ambulance. There actually were several RTs on this forum for a short time but most have moved on. There were many memorable posts here. TexRNmedic referred to the RT vs RN vs Paramedic debates which were in the least colorful and ofter very mean spirited.

As far as bashing the Paramedic profession, no not that not true. Those who see it as bashing are usually those with a 3 - 6 month cert who get easily offended and are afraid of advancement.

Also, like many others, a dual credential is not impossible to get. If you look at the signatures, you will see many different letters behind their names.

Now, let me ask you if your are a member of the AARC and your state's RT society?

Do you care about the advancement of RT or would you prefer most of our duties go back to nursing and RTs be replaced in the EDs and ICUs by Paramedics?

I would like to see all the professions advance since each specialty have alot to bring to the patient. RN should be a BSN minimum. RT needs to achieve the BSRT minimum or at least support the bills in play now for advancement. The Paramedic must someday get to the Associates degree but that is now not on the table for another 10 - 15 years.

If you want to bash those who want to see the RT profession grow, that is your right. But you should know it is also my right to put some positive words in about the RT profession also. You will find lots of support on this forum to get rid of RTs as a profession or at least eliminate them from any form on transport including neonatal. Search the archives of this forum.

I also invite you to share your opinions on the AARC forum as to why you believe we should not be supportive of RT as a profession and not just give up to nursing.If you believe RT has no future, please share that on the AARC forum with your reasons.

Personally I am not so willing to allow someone whose ink is still wet on his credential sell out my profession as an RT without making it known there is much more. But, then you also disagree so be it. But, at least present your point of view on an RT forum instead of one where there are mostly RNs and Paramedics.
  • 0

#27 FloridaMedic

FloridaMedic

    Advanced Member

  • Banned
  • PipPipPip
  • 790 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 09:03 PM

This forum is indeed a collective community of many various providers. Also, IMHO, there exists a strong RT presence here.



How many RTs would you say there are here posting regularly?

Back in 2007 there were at least 10 that I saw posting regularly.
  • 0

#28 Gila

Gila

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 588 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 09:09 PM

The RN credential is still there and I have not altered it recently.

Edit: The question that I was asked is gone, disregard the statement above.
  • 0
Christopher Bare
"Non fui, fui, non sum, non curo "

#29 Jwade

Jwade

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1405 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 09:29 PM

Dear FloridaMedic:

Can you please define what "enough experience" is in order to "offer a[] positive comment"? My understanding is that the flightweb is a collective community of health care professionals, from all walks and experiences, to share information. Should we request that people who do fit into your "experience" threshold be banned from posting onto the forums? Moreover, should we make you the gatekeeper to determine who passes this threshold? In my opinion, you would delete every user that does not comport to your viewpoints.

Another observation... I have always wondered on why somebody who bashes the paramedic profession, while trying to gain support of the RT profession, would utilize a screen name of "FloridaMedic".



EXACTLY my point!

FM does nothing but attack anyone who is a non-conformist.

Again, FloridaMedic, you have done nothing to answer any of the questions put forth, instead relying on Ad Hominem personal attacks to deflect the argument away from your own shortcomings.

I will respectfully disagree with your assertion that just because someone lectures or gives a class many times on a certain topic does not automatically qualify them as " Rock Star" status......I have worked with many Trauma Surgeons in the Operating Room who have written many books, articles,research, give lectures for the American College of Surgeons, and, many of them are barely competent surgeons at best. VERY FEW surgeons are truly " Gifted" when you actually work side by side with them, you learn this quickly. So, please excuse me if I am cautious and not as willing to brand someone a Rock Star just because they publish.......

It is a well documented and known fact, many academic community physicians would NEVER survive in private practice due to their arrogance, competence, and not having an entourage to follow behind them and fix all of their mistakes.

I have attended lectures by Sean, Will, Michael, and found them to be extremely knowledgable, i have not worked in a clinical situation with any of them, so I would not be able to brand them as Rock Stars without specifically experiencing that situation.......

People in medicine right crap frequently, much of it is complete junk and a significant waste of time, but, that is what they are good at doing , so they continue, very few actually put forth anything that truly makes a difference.

In grad school, they showed us a research study that showed >50% of the PhD professors who teach in academic institutions have < 1 year of actual work experience in the field they teach. So, I am not willing to brand anyone a Rock Star just because they happen to meet your narrow minded definition of a mover and shaker......


The ANA position paper of 1965 recommend the entry level for RN to practice would be the BSN.....CLEARLY that has not happened, nor will it be anytime in the near future......As long as there is a severe nursing shortage in rural areas, the associate degree programs will continue to provide the majority of RN's who practice in the United States. The differences between an ADN RN and BSN are statistically insignificant when it comes to providing direct patient care. This has been proved time and time again, and is not even up for debate. While, I am certainly PRO EDUCATION, i disagree with your theory that having a BSN would bring more to the patient than the ADN nurse.

The BSN could in theory have more of an impact on community health policy and disease prevention, but, when it comes to functional and primary nursing care, there is no difference.

The Original Poster stated he was interested in the NICU, I would advise him to find a NICU mentor, and continue his education and experience that would afford him the best opportunity to get the position that is congruent with his stated intentions. If that ends up being a nursing route, then by all means!

JW
  • 0
John Wade MBA, CCEMT-P, FP-C, RN

"Have the courage to follow your heart and intuition, they somehow already know what you truly want to become" Steve Jobs

#30 flightrrt

flightrrt

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 79 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 09:44 PM

[quote name='FloridaMedic' date='29 January 2012 - 03:59 PM' timestamp='1327870794' post='28366']
Tom is newly credentialed. That is easy enough to confirm and he himself has posted this information along with others who have stated he is finishing his RT degree.
A newcomer to the profession should not be so down on it until has had an opportunity to experience it.
[/quote]

Referring you back to my original question, "[c]an you please define what "enough experience" is in order to "offer a[] positive comment"? Again, you attack Tom for being new to the profession. Please provide Tom with some guidance on at what point in his career could he provide any type of comment. If this is your means of mentoring, it is a foul.

You referred to "rock stars" earlier. I presume you consider yourself part of this elite group because you are a member of the AARC and the transport section. However, your classification of "rock star" is misled. First, a "rock star" should be somebody that peers look up to for advice. Your comments have consistently belittled RTs (supra) and every other health care profession. In addition, a "rock star" is able to take constructive criticism. You fit neither of these descriptions. Rather, and I will point you back to many of your earlier posts, you have taken it upon yourself to downgrade every other profession while standing behind your RT credential. This is not the face that RTs in general need for their spokesperson.

[quote]
Now, let me ask you if your are a member of the AARC and your state's RT society?
[/quote]

I am neither a member of the AARC nor my state's RT society. Does this not make me qualified, in your view, to provide a comment? While I previously was a member of both these groups, I personally did not receive any value add from these memberships. However, you will notice that these organizations do not raise their agenda through the belittlement of the other health professions.

[quote]
I also invite you to share your opinions on the AARC forum as to why you believe we should not be supportive of RT as a profession and not just give up to nursing.If you believe RT has no future, please share that on the AARC forum with your reasons.
[/quote]

Please do not misquote or take any of my comments out of context. I never once attempted to profess that we should not be supportive of our profession, whatever profession that is. However, I will state, and you can quote me on this, that bashing another profession is not a means to the end you desire.

[quote]
Personally I am not so willing to allow someone whose ink is still wet on his credential sell out my profession as an RT without making it known there is much more. But, then you also disagree so be it. But, at least present your point of view on an RT forum instead of one where there are mostly RNs and Paramedics.
[/quote]

Again, this is another example of not being supportive of your own species. Honestly, I believe that you think anybody who does not have as much experience, education, and the like compared to you is not worth the ink.
  • 0
Aaron J. Lund, JD, LL.M., CHC, CHPC, CHRC, RRT-NPS
Healthcare Corporate Compliance Officer
Former, Flight Respiratory Therapist

#31 FloridaMedic

FloridaMedic

    Advanced Member

  • Banned
  • PipPipPip
  • 790 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 11:38 PM

[quote name='flightrrt' date='29 January 2012 - 04:44 PM' timestamp='1327873455' post='28370']
Referring you back to my original question, "[c]an you please define what "enough experience" is in order to "offer a[] positive comment"? Again, you attack Tom for being new to the profession. Please provide Tom with some guidance on at what point in his career could he provide any type of comment. If this is your means of mentoring, it is a foul. [/quote]

This is not an RT website so by PM I have given him advice to seek more answers to his question through the AARC discussion section. There is no need to hyjack this section anymore but if you insist....

Too bad you can not log onto the AARC to express your discontent for the members.


[quote name='flightrrt' date='29 January 2012 - 04:44 PM' timestamp='1327873455' post='28370']

You referred to "rock stars" earlier. I presume you consider yourself part of this elite group because you are a member of the AARC and the transport section. However, your classification of "rock star" is misled. First, a "rock star" should be somebody that peers look up to for advice. Your comments have consistently belittled RTs (supra) and every other health care profession. In addition, a "rock star" is able to take constructive criticism. You fit neither of these descriptions. Rather, and I will point you back to many of your earlier posts, you have taken it upon yourself to downgrade every other profession while standing behind your RT credential. This is not the face that RTs in general need for their spokesperson. [/quote]

I guess you are trying to insult me or anyone who is a member of the AARC and the transport section. Too bad you feel that way about people who are active in the association and do take time to stay current on events.

Point out exactly where I have degree "every other profession". Please be very specific. If you don't like my comments about advancement or education, tough.

Now, if you have no idea who the rock stars are of the RT profession or don't care enough to get involved in any aspect of the professional associations, I don't feel like even wasting my time on you. It is a shame you do not know names like McIntyre, Bird, Emerson, Hess, Branson, Kallet, Siobal and the list goes on.


[quote name='flightrrt' date='29 January 2012 - 04:44 PM' timestamp='1327873455' post='28370']

I am neither a member of the AARC nor my state's RT society. Does this not make me qualified, in your view, to provide a comment? While I previously was a member of both these groups, I personally did not receive any value add from these memberships. However, you will notice that these organizations do not raise their agenda through the belittlement of the other health professions. [/quote]

That explains alot. Please point out where any organization has belittled other professions. RT (AARC and state societies) and nursing has collaborated several times on issues especially when it comes to providing care for patients at the local, state and Federal levels.

You say you did not see any benefits but yet you enjoy the wage increases we have received over the years and that most are still employed although that could change in the future if more are not proactive for the profession. Bashing the national association is not a good way to promote RT as a profession. Bashing those who support the state and national organizations also lack professionalism.


[quote name='flightrrt' date='29 January 2012 - 04:44 PM' timestamp='1327873455' post='28370']

Please do not misquote or take any of my comments out of context. I never once attempted to profess that we should not be supportive of our profession, whatever profession that is. However, I will state, and you can quote me on this, that bashing another profession is not a means to the end you desire. [/quote]
Again show exactly where I have bashed any profession. Many have been offended here because I promote higher educational standards for EMS and that puts fear into those who like it as it is now and don't like change. Did you drop out of the RT associations when they started to promote higher education?


[quote name='flightrrt' date='29 January 2012 - 04:44 PM' timestamp='1327873455' post='28370']

Again, this is another example of not being supportive of your own species. Honestly, I believe that you think anybody who does not have as much experience, education, and the like compared to you is not worth the ink.
[/quote]

I just think RT needed to have some positve comments made about it also.

When a new RT can not see what his profession has to offer then there is a problem.

But, you are not a member of any RT association and you bash those of us who are. Why don't you tell Tom to drop his membership? Bash him for being a member although his probably came with the Bachelors program since those programs tend to recommend it.
  • 0

#32 FloridaMedic

FloridaMedic

    Advanced Member

  • Banned
  • PipPipPip
  • 790 posts

Posted 29 January 2012 - 11:54 PM

EXACTLY my point!

FM does nothing but attack anyone who is a non-conformist.

Again, FloridaMedic, you have done nothing to answer any of the questions put forth, instead relying on Ad Hominem personal attacks to deflect the argument away from your own shortcomings.

I will respectfully disagree with your assertion that just because someone lectures or gives a class many times on a certain topic does not automatically qualify them as " Rock Star" status......I have worked with many Trauma Surgeons in the Operating Room who have written many books, articles,research, give lectures for the American College of Surgeons, and, many of them are barely competent surgeons at best. VERY FEW surgeons are truly " Gifted" when you actually work side by side with them, you learn this quickly. So, please excuse me if I am cautious and not as willing to brand someone a Rock Star just because they publish.......

It is a well documented and known fact, many academic community physicians would NEVER survive in private practice due to their arrogance, competence, and not having an entourage to follow behind them and fix all of their mistakes.

I have attended lectures by Sean, Will, Michael, and found them to be extremely knowledgable, i have not worked in a clinical situation with any of them, so I would not be able to brand them as Rock Stars without specifically experiencing that situation.......

People in medicine right crap frequently, much of it is complete junk and a significant waste of time, but, that is what they are good at doing , so they continue, very few actually put forth anything that truly makes a difference.

In grad school, they showed us a research study that showed >50% of the PhD professors who teach in academic institutions have < 1 year of actual work experience in the field they teach. So, I am not willing to brand anyone a Rock Star just because they happen to meet your narrow minded definition of a mover and shaker......


The ANA position paper of 1965 recommend the entry level for RN to practice would be the BSN.....CLEARLY that has not happened, nor will it be anytime in the near future......As long as there is a severe nursing shortage in rural areas, the associate degree programs will continue to provide the majority of RN's who practice in the United States. The differences between an ADN RN and BSN are statistically insignificant when it comes to providing direct patient care. This has been proved time and time again, and is not even up for debate. While, I am certainly PRO EDUCATION, i disagree with your theory that having a BSN would bring more to the patient than the ADN nurse.

The BSN could in theory have more of an impact on community health policy and disease prevention, but, when it comes to functional and primary nursing care, there is no difference.

The Original Poster stated he was interested in the NICU, I would advise him to find a NICU mentor, and continue his education and experience that would afford him the best opportunity to get the position that is congruent with his stated intentions. If that ends up being a nursing route, then by all means!

JW


And here we have the leading authority on Respiratory Therapists, Registered Nurses and everything else in the world. Only JW's opinion matters.


BTW, I never said anyone who just "lectures" is a rock star. That is just an ignorant statement on your part. I would imagine there are many who believe themselves to be great speakers are really crap and I wouldn't waste my time listening to them twice. I mentioned several notable people in RT in my post to flightrrt but I don't expect you to know who they are. I have met a few of them. I have heard some of them lecture and I have read what they have written if they have done so. I respect them for their accomplishments. Maybe you should get past your own bragging JW to look at what others have accomplished instead of trying to find fault with doctors and anyone else around you. Maybe you are just insecure which is why you keep bragging about all you have done.

Your post does however shed light on why the Paramedic is still a votech cert after all of these years. As your comparison for BSN vs ADN, if a 6 month cert is good enough, no need for all of that education crap to get an AS. Yeah you and I disagree on almost everything. Education for the Paramedic is a biggie and I still firmly believe it should be an Associates degree minimum just like RT. But then most will perceive that to be bashing and unfair to say a Paramedic should have more than 6 months of training.

JW, you remind of an article I read recently since you are quick to put down anyone who might have an interest in medicine as unworthy.

http://tango.bol.ucl...cations/A40.pdf

You also haven't asked any questions worth answering. You make a mockery of the questions I asked and it is a shame you don't know anyone who has helped shape EMS for the better past or present in even a little way.
  • 0

#33 Jwade

Jwade

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1405 posts

Posted 30 January 2012 - 12:17 AM

And here we have the leading authority on Respiratory Therapists, Registered Nurses and everything else in the world. Only JW's opinion matters.


BTW, I never said anyone who just "lectures" is a rock star. That is just an ignorant statement on your part. I would imagine there are many who believe themselves to be great speakers are really crap and I wouldn't waste my time listening to them twice. I mentioned several notable people in RT in my post to flightrrt but I don't expect you to know who they are. I have met a few of them. I have heard some of them lecture and I have read what they have written if they have done so. I respect them for their accomplishments. Maybe you should get past your own bragging JW to look at what others have accomplished instead of trying to find fault with doctors and anyone else around you. Maybe you are just insecure which is why you keep bragging about all you have done.

Your post does however shed light on why the Paramedic is still a votech cert after all of these years. As your comparison for BSN vs ADN, if a 6 month cert is good enough, no need for all of that education crap to get an AS. Yeah you and I disagree on almost everything. Education for the Paramedic is a biggie and I still firmly believe it should be an Associates degree minimum just like RT. But then most will perceive that to be bashing and unfair to say a Paramedic should have more than 6 months of training.

JW, you remind of an article I read recently since you are quick to put down anyone who might have an interest in medicine as unworthy.

http://tango.bol.ucl...cations/A40.pdf

You also haven't asked any questions worth answering. You make a mockery of the questions I asked and it is a shame you don't know anyone who has helped shape EMS for the better past or present in even a little way.



FM,

Here is the bottom line since you cannot formulate it on your own.

1. NOBODY here is bashing RT's, I certainly have not made one negative comment towards RT's. I have worked with some great RT's over the years in my flight career. They taught me most of what I know about vent mgt.

2. The BSN to ADN comparison is valid and one the Nursing profession has been trying to deal with since 1965. Having studied many of the curriculums for both BSN and ADN's the MEAN will not teach much of anything that directly applies to Functional and Primary Nursing care. Look up any nursing study funded by the ANA and show me where the additional education from a BSN will have any direct impact on the patient in the SICU versus an ADN working in the SICU. There is NO statistical difference....The evidence bores this out time and time again, and since you and I are supposed to be practicing evidenced based medicine, I will go with what the studies prove.

3. I am a huge proponent of Advanced Education. If anyone was to look through any of my past comments, it is beyond contestation that I do not think Associate degrees should be the entry level for Paramedics. I absolutely think they should be!

4. Unlike you, I have not been bragging about anything. I have given factual statements that are beyond reproach. To borrow a quote from you " If you don't like my comments and differing opinion" TOUGH! ;)

5. I am NOT a leading authority on anything RT related, please show me one example where I have stated otherwise.

6. Again, I don't respect someone just because they write an article and get it published..........BIG DEAL......Thousands of people do this everyday............It takes a lot more than simply writing an article or giving a lecture here and there for them to earn my respect.
  • 0
John Wade MBA, CCEMT-P, FP-C, RN

"Have the courage to follow your heart and intuition, they somehow already know what you truly want to become" Steve Jobs

#34 flightrrt

flightrrt

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 79 posts

Posted 30 January 2012 - 12:45 AM

FloridaMedic:

While clarity is not your strongest attribute, let me make myself very clear to you.

First, I have criticized your inability to adequately address any question posed to you. Rather, you directly attack the individual. You started this string by openly disgracing Tom for being new to the profession. I merely sought clarification on when would consider that a person had enough experience to provide fruitful input to a discussion. You still have not answered this question. However, you have been extremely successful on then taking that question and twisting it to insinuate that I am not worthy of my profession.

Second, you are a master at placing words into a person's mouth. Where I have ever once expressed my discontent with the members of the AARC? I did state, and let me make this VERY CLEAR TO YOU, that I did not find the value add in maintaining my membership affiliation with either the AARC or the state organizations. While you may feel this is an insult to the profession, I was simply voicing my opinion. My reference to you considering yourself inclusive in this "rock star" group was purely made from continual observations of your omniscient attitude towards others on this board.

Third, you attack me by assuming what I know and what I don't know. However, you lack the knowledge to even assert these presumptions. While I do not feel the need to recite my resume or educational background, I can affirm that I have been around the block for a while and do know a great many leaders within the industry.

Finally, and I hate to even go here, but, your platform on higher education is laughable. As an opponent for higher education I would hope that you could form a complete sentence. Moreover, I would hope would understand proper punctuation. You continual slaughter of the English language, while attempting to profess that people lack education, is nauseating.

You must act like a leader to continue movement within the profession. You have failed miserably at showing these qualities.
  • 0
Aaron J. Lund, JD, LL.M., CHC, CHPC, CHRC, RRT-NPS
Healthcare Corporate Compliance Officer
Former, Flight Respiratory Therapist

#35 BrianACNP

BrianACNP

    Advanced Member

  • Moderators
  • PipPipPip
  • 591 posts

Posted 30 January 2012 - 12:53 AM

Ok guys....I've read enough. Let's move past this exchange and move on to something more meaningful that projects the aeromedical profession. I would hate to shut this down, but will if this continues.

Thanks,

Brian
  • 0
Brian, MSN, ACNP, CCRN

#36 Matt_USN

Matt_USN

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 6 posts

Posted 30 January 2012 - 07:39 PM

I appreciate the input of all who replied, and the PMs from those regarding the ongoing "conflict". I do have an active membership at AARC and will check the forums there as well. I do not have a deep understanding of the nursing field - I believe NPs can specialize. Being a RN has little appeal to me at this point in time, as I am still leaning towards specializing (and obviously the respiratory field is looking real good right now). Can a RN pick a specialty? If I had to pick right now, I'd probably get my BSRT. I'm thinking NICU + RT research is where I'll be happy, but until I get out of the class and into a hospital, I readily admit I have no idea. Experience (my own and from others, like yourselves) will allow me to make an informed decision when the time comes.

I understand that picking a specialty may make it difficult to get involved in HEMS, as you all have made it clear (HEMS RTs are rare). If that is the case, I can still be happy with my choice even if it keeps my feet planted on the ground.

Again, I thank all of you for your valuable input; it truly does help me seeing both sides of the coin. I hope this conversation can continue in a civilized manner, as I know this thread will be of use to future RTs who venture over here.
  • 0

#37 Gila

Gila

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 588 posts

Posted 30 January 2012 - 09:38 PM

Yes, there exist many specialty areas and certifications for nurses. Also, nurse practitioners can further specialise. For example, Brian on this forum is an ACNP (acute/adult care nurse practitioner). Other specialties such as paediatric and family are also possible. Good luck whatever your choice.
  • 0
Christopher Bare
"Non fui, fui, non sum, non curo "

#38 yourAVERAGEmedic

yourAVERAGEmedic

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 187 posts

Posted 01 February 2012 - 03:15 AM

I appreciate the input of all who replied, and the PMs from those regarding the ongoing "conflict". I do have an active membership at AARC and will check the forums there as well. I do not have a deep understanding of the nursing field - I believe NPs can specialize. Being a RN has little appeal to me at this point in time, as I am still leaning towards specializing (and obviously the respiratory field is looking real good right now). Can a RN pick a specialty? If I had to pick right now, I'd probably get my BSRT. I'm thinking NICU + RT research is where I'll be happy, but until I get out of the class and into a hospital, I readily admit I have no idea. Experience (my own and from others, like yourselves) will allow me to make an informed decision when the time comes.

I understand that picking a specialty may make it difficult to get involved in HEMS, as you all have made it clear (HEMS RTs are rare). If that is the case, I can still be happy with my choice even if it keeps my feet planted on the ground.

Again, I thank all of you for your valuable input; it truly does help me seeing both sides of the coin. I hope this conversation can continue in a civilized manner, as I know this thread will be of use to future RTs who venture over here.


Matt,
You have demonstrated here an interest in 1) expanding your education beyond the typical role 2) reaching to great heights in transport 3) learning as much as you can to be a better provider for your patients.

These are things you should be applauded for. There is never a good reason to not push yourself to get more education. Nobody ever regretted learning more. I haven't been doing my job forever, nor am I a roookie. I've been fortunate and have had lots of opportunities to learn and many opportunies to grow professionally. There is one thing I have learned...someone always knows more than me. Each of our goals is not to be the best one out there...rather it is to be the best provider we each can be. Sounds like you have a good head on your shoulders by broadening your education and background.

Yes, the RRT is a specialist. Paramedics are licensed. Nurses dominate the industry. Nobody should be belittled for their accomplishments or their role.

John is right. There are very few people or programs that have made earth shattering changes to our industry. There is no one be all-end all expert...but that is OK. We all do things fairly similarly and find small ways to make things better. Because our industry has a lot of turn over and is growing rapidly the fundamentals are important. Keep learning, find mentors in every area you can and turn around and teach what you know.

Anyone who suggests that any RT/RN/Paramedic can't learn from the other is naieve. WE can all learn and can all grow. you showed an interest to advance. Go for it!
  • 0

Kevin Collopy, BA, FP-C, CCEMT-P, NREMT-P, CMTE


#39 nautilus

nautilus

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 2 posts

Posted 12 February 2012 - 06:36 AM

As an enthusiastic reader of the case studies on these forums, I was saddened at the tone of the thread I just scanned through. It brought to mind an image of junior high boys in a fight for validation over who's cooler.

It started me thinking on the consequences of Professionalism or the lack thereof in an environment where patient care is paramount. What are the consequences to patient care when we can't get out of the way of our own egos? What happens to the patient when the caregivers (regardless of what letters come after your name) can't have a civil discussion? If we can't work as a team, at best we doom our patients to crappy care, at worst we cause harm because we're thinking about how pissed we are at someone rather than attending to the patients needs. If you act like that on a scene its a matter of when, not if you will kill a patient.
  • 0

#40 Mike Mims

Mike Mims

    Advanced Member

  • Moderators
  • PipPipPip
  • 1668 posts

Posted 12 February 2012 - 05:12 PM

As an enthusiastic reader of the case studies on these forums, I was saddened at the tone of the thread I just scanned through. It brought to mind an image of junior high boys in a fight for validation over who's cooler.

It started me thinking on the consequences of Professionalism or the lack thereof in an environment where patient care is paramount. What are the consequences to patient care when we can't get out of the way of our own egos? What happens to the patient when the caregivers (regardless of what letters come after your name) can't have a civil discussion? If we can't work as a team, at best we doom our patients to crappy care, at worst we cause harm because we're thinking about how pissed we are at someone rather than attending to the patients needs. If you act like that on a scene its a matter of when, not if you will kill a patient.

Yes we all will disagree from time-to-time on issues, either from personal experience or out of passion for the topic being debated.
HOWEVER, I have no question that as time goes by, things calm down or you turn the other cheek, so-to-speak, we look back and may have done or said things differently and not add fuel to the fire........

I believe this thread is a good example that sometimes everything doesn't go "peachy-king" regardless of the efforts.......

Let's be careful and not go back to square one with this thread.
  • 0

Mike Mims

Aircare

University of Mississippi Medical Center