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Us Army Jecc Course


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#1 Dustoff1259

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 03:17 PM

The US Army's Joint Enroute Care Course has caught my attention lately and Ive been following whats been posted here about it. Ive heard the course described in different ways including that it is the CCEMT-P course abbreviated for the military.

If anyone here has attended the course, What is actually taught critical care wise?

My thoughts are that if each Army aircraft has a flight medic assigned as a crew member, then why not develope the Flight medic's skill and confidence in transporting critcal care patients and leave the ground nurses where they belong?

I think the flight medic Program at Ft. Rucker should be as high speed as the SOCM or 18-D programs and in the end you would have(In my unrealistic vision) A flight Medic with all the usual AC skills like NVG,Hoist ops, Sling loads, etc but also a NREMT-P or ATP CCEMP-P or some other CC training (JECC) and of course the usual courses like ACLS, ITLS/PHTLS, PEPP, NRP, etc

As it stands now, what you get when you call for a Army MEDEVAC helicopter is and EMT Basic ( schooled in a 4-6 week cram course) and probably very little EMS and/patient care experience. You are likely to get an EMT that could be certified in ACLS but has never ran a code or done any live intubations.

I think our sick and wounded deserve better that whats in place. I think The JECC (what very little I know about it) is a step in the right direction but it should be for Flight medics as a requirement (and it might be I dont know )
and then as a course for Nurses and others that may have to assist during flights.

Im interested in your thoughts.

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#2 old school

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 06:04 PM

I haven't been to JECC so I can't speak about the course specifically, and I'm not an Army flight medic so I also can't comment on the specifics of their training or skill set.

If I'm not mistake, JECC is focused specifically on interfacility critical care transport. I'm pretty sure that's not what medics in the Army are trained to do. If, as you said yourself, most Army medics are trained only to the EMT-B level, then it would probably take a prohibitive amount of training and clinical time to bring most of them up to the point of being able to handle critical care interfacility transfers. Why would you bother training large numbers of EMT-B's to do critical care transfers, when you have critical care RN's that can do those transports?

As for the scene flights, the truth is that most traumatic injuries - even severe ones - can be adequately managed with good BLS care. Airway management is obviously important in some patients, but good airway management doesn't necessarilly = intubation.

I wouldn't bash the military's system too much....I don't doubt that it could use improvement, but from what I understand most of what they do is strictly evidence-based, and they have impressive success with severe trauma, so they must be doing something right. It sounds like they've learned an awful lot in Iraq that will hopefully be applied to help improve the system.
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bring it in for the real thing

#3 Dustoff1259

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 06:34 PM

I haven't been to JECC so I can't speak about the course specifically, and I'm not an Army flight medic so I also can't comment on the specifics of their training or skill set.

If I'm not mistake, JECC is focused specifically on interfacility critical care transport. I'm pretty sure that's not what medics in the Army are trained to do. If, as you said yourself, most Army medics are trained only to the EMT-B level, then it would probably take a prohibitive amount of training and clinical time to bring most of them up to the point of being able to handle critical care interfacility transfers. Why would you bother training large numbers of EMT-B's to do critical care transfers, when you have critical care RN's that can do those transports?

As for the scene flights, the truth is that most traumatic injuries - even severe ones - can be adequately managed with good BLS care. Airway management is obviously important in some patients, but good airway management doesn't necessarilly = intubation.

I wouldn't bash the military's system too much....I don't doubt that it could use improvement, but from what I understand most of what they do is strictly evidence-based, and they have impressive success with severe trauma, so they must be doing something right. It sounds like they've learned an awful lot in Iraq that will hopefully be applied to help improve the system.


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#4 Dustoff1259

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Posted 17 November 2008 - 06:53 PM

I appreciate your point of view although I'm not bashing the system. I just think that now that our nation has been at war for some time now that some of that evidence based medicine you posted about should be applied to improving the Flight Medic Program.

No one should assume that just because a student stayed awake through JECC and that they are a nurse /other medical officer, that some how they are up to the task of taking care of patients in flight. As many inexperienced flight medics there are in the Army can be compared to just as many inexperienced nurses.

A friend of mine in theater also told me that where she is nurses are dying to get away from the MTF and experience the thrill of a blackhawk ride. Many of them are more interested in the sights around them while flying than the patient they are transporting.

JECC from what little I know about it sounds like a good thing in the end whether nurses or medics attend.

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#5 Canned Heat

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Posted 27 November 2008 - 12:34 AM

I went to JECC last year. It's joint service so not exclusive to Army. My class had nurses and medics attending. I found the course to be well done and clinically relevant given the short time frame. The JECC is a good supplement for predeployment if that is going to be your mission.

My experience with the Army Flight medics was very positive. The experience base is always a broad mix ranging from being EMT-Basic trained up to EMT-P. Training them to higher levels isn't a bad idea, but really has little bearing on the logistics behind inserting ERC Nurses who are there to provide continued critical care from whatever 2nd or 3rd echelon of care the patient came from. JECC does not teach you how to be clinically proficient at managing a vent patient. You should already know that before taking the course. JECC teaches you how to apply critical care nursing in the operational transport environment. The JECC was a solid course for getting me ready for deployment especially since I had been out of that element for a while. I found it very helpful when it boiled down to doing my job when I had to.

You are right, staying awake during a class doesn't make you the best one for the job. A lot of it boils down to maturity, restraint, and experience. I believe the folks we're working on in operational environments are getting great care in the back of helicopters among other places. Like everything else, there is always room for improvement from the Medic to the ERC Nurse. Like I said before, we had a good number of flight medics in my class so the training is there. It was relevant to all of us.

I also never got the impression from any of the Army medics I flew with that they wanted me on the ground where I belonged and seemed perfectly fine with the fact that I was there. That old nurse vs medic rivalry is something I left behind when I joined the Navy. It doesn't suit the military environment or foster mission completion.

If you made the Army flight medic program "High Speed" like 18D and SOCM there would be too many people running around with beards, expensive sunglasses and dive watches.
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#6 Dustoff1259

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Posted 27 November 2008 - 03:15 PM

Canned Heat: Thanks for posting in. I appreciate your point of view. As for beards, expensive sun glasses, and diving watches...you left out base ball caps!
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#7 RonBolen

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 04:57 PM

I am an instructor for the JECC. En Route Care is intended for the intubated post surgical pt to be moved from forward surgical units back to medical units further back. It is not a "generic flight nurse course". It is also a joint class where Air Force, Army, and Navy attend. It is fluid in its curriculum at the moment as it continues to eveolve, and is alo only one peice of the puzzle in the complete training program. As for the Navy, they have to be a critical care or ER trained RN, have completed water survival training that includes the Dunker, and then have a final Navy ERC check-off. Then they are to fill a billet as an ERC Nurse. They problems we are currently trying to tackle are how to train the skillsets needed and maintain those Skillsets CONUS. We are teaming with current civilian programs to tackle some of this.
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#8 Dustoff1259

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Posted 12 December 2008 - 02:12 PM

NavyRN: Thanks for sharing the information. How do most enlisted students do in the course? Do they seem lost! Thanks again for any information.
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#9 FPC Selvage

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Posted 12 April 2010 - 05:21 PM

I'm a civillian Flight Paramedic, but am interested in taking the class if possible. Is it possible?
Thanks in advance
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#10 Dustoff1259

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Posted 14 April 2010 - 07:24 PM

FPC Selvage: I'm no the final word on JECC but I think you have to be a US military service member in a unit that requires JECC skills.
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